Crusier rail photos!
Here are a few photos of me riding the Model-C right after Interbike. I couldn't run them without getting into trouble, but now I don't have to worry about that anymore! Look for an update release date for all the new 2009 frames.Photos Jon Capozzi
posted by Sunday! @ 9:22 AM
57 Comments:
it's gotta be the shoes...
i was thinking the same thing. that swoosh is pretty obvious.
Are those another firsts? hangover tooth on a cruiser.
no more beloe?
nice tooth hang
Wow - really looks like the model-c means business!
Any word on the final specs?
22" size?
Shorter rear-end?
I've had my fingers crossed for bloody ages...!
wow thats crazy but gay at the some time ride a bmx bike you better not have your next video part with one of these mtn bikes
sooo pimpin photo's! and ... where are those railz!
totally wild, definately never seen a hang tooth with big wheels b4 - fucking epic!
cant wait till these come out look sooo much fun
what sizes did you decide on?(i voted for 21.75 & 22.25) & are you keeping the high bb, long stay geo? cos i reckon if you shortened the chainstays u could have a lower bb and still keep the same feeling, ie: 13"bb, 14"cs found out that 13.75 is the higher that many proper mtbs with 6" travel suspension!!!! seems a bit ridiculous for a rigid 24 therefore...
15.25 stays are race length...
whatever tho - as long as i can hangover toothpick gnarly rails on me way to work i'll be happy!
pretty shady that you were wearing another shoe while you had a shoe sponsor.
if your gonna be selling these as high end frame/forks i really hope you've refined the geo a bit as b4 it seemed a bit pie in the sky for what you aiming for.
15.25 chainstays on a bike intended for freestyle is absurd in this day and age IMO. the bb seemed insanely high for 24" wheels and you definately need to offer at least 3 sizes - otherwise you may as well just make another fit, subrosa, wethepeople, dk,etc,etc cheap ass complete and cash in
really hope you guys take this the whole way and come through with a serious freestyle cruiser frameset
nice photoshop skillz. FAKE!
Nah, not shady just looking for more knowledge. Ended up on the short end of the stick with Beloe. Wasn't going to get anything from my shoe, so I figured I do what I wanted.
As for the dimensions, we are planning on shortening the rear end down to just under 15. And offering two sizes 21.25 and 21.75. I feel that the whole sizing of cruisers is so uncertain. Once you ride this set up, you will understand. Also please don't compare this to a Subrosa, DK or any other comfort cruiser. Doing a rail on one of those bikes would be torture!
later,
jim
That's awesome. So you left Beloe?
Im amped on this, I was just about to get a Subrosa cruzer until stumbled on the model-C. I finaly get to ride for transportation and have fun on it to!
They will be sold complete yes?
why you hiding railss!!! haha
good news on the new dimensions, thanks for listening to peoples input on the last updates, it was really refreshing hear people offer mature constructive critism instead of the usual innate, random hate!
Thanks sunday for doing something new
would still like a 22.5 though...
Hey Jim
Looking good!
Kinda disapointed about the sizes though - had a look back at the comments on that post and the majority of people wanted a 22+ option.
Personally at 6'5" i don't want to ride a bike shorter than my current 22" Macneil deuce, been considering the move to bigger wheels but it's not worth it if i'm gonna feel more cramped than on my 20...
I really think your overlooking the majority of potential customers, who are gonna be people like myself who feel on the cusp of being too big for bmx.
3 sizes would be perfect ie: add 22.25 as an option.
Or 21 and 22 would be better if u can only do 2...
22.25"tt FTW !
how high can u hop on one of those things?
& whats the offset on the forks?
& r u going to give it a nice wavy downtube?
Oh & weights????!!!!
nice work btw
p.s pleeeaaassseee do a 22...
the rails are at buff state and that is the same rail
pretty crazy on a cruiser!
sorry to hear about beloe...
can't wait to get a legit 24 for freestyle shenanigans!
glad your shortening the stays, reckon you should go as short as poss.
would prefer a 22+, but 21.75 is close enough i guess, hopefully the higher bars will help...
if you did 3 sizes u could keep everyone happy...
What's up with the rims? Is Odyssey gonna make some nice 24s for us to buy?
when r these gonna be out, how much will they cost and will they come with a lifetime warranty?
IMO 21.5 and 22.25 would of been better tt lengths but glad ur tightening up the rear end!
p.s. tell george i'd love to get some 24" ribcages....
i saw that bike do a hop whip!
kinda had my heart set on a longer toptube, guess i'll have to go down the custom route....
it's ggod that your doing them tho, there needs to be more 24 options.
can u post a pic of aaron ross riding one of these and the hop whip, not that i'm not loving the toothyhanger (although the pedal grind looks a bit sketchy - the wheels practically touching the stairs!)
super psyched on these bikes - bout time someone brought out a 24 you can actually ride like a 20 and that doesn't look like the mutant offspring of a bmx & mtb!
also hope you bring out a longer size....i have size 13 feet and i really can't imagine i'll be throwin the bars with only 21.75 up front...
hey jim
glad ur going through with this,
just hope the bikes work as well for me! pretty nuts!
keep up the good work
p.s. i also wondered about the warranty?
also proper gutted bout the sizes, really hoped i'd finally found the frame to fit me lanky self
Would it be better to run 180mm cranks rather than 175mm cranks on these?
Pleeease add a 22.25 to the sizes, i'm 6'6 & NEED at least a 22
Either that or do the model-d in a 22, give us tall fellas some options
gotta say i was really hoping you'd do a larger size than 22, didn't think you go as long as 22.5 but was counting on there being at least a 22..
don't think only 2 sizes is enough for a quality frameset, and 21.25 is somewhat pointless as you can get loads of 20's in that size
longer tt, super short stays in black magic and i'd def buy one
21.25 seems too short 4 a cruiser should do 21.75 & 22.25 with 14.25 rear and 13.25 bb
yup, these r definately what i've been waiting for - somehow i can't imagine someone doing a toothhang on a 24 mtb!
can't wait to ride one...
white elephant
glad the stays are going to be sub 15"(is that just slammed tho?), not so chuffed bout the tt - but hopefully if these sell well you can offer more sizes (tho i woulda thought more people would of been interested in longer sizes on a cruiser, ie: 21.5 & 22....)
really hope you do a black colour and a brakeless option
My initial thoughts are that again the sizing is yet undetermined for these types of frames. There is still much uncertainty with what dimensions will work best for every rider. My thoughts are there is no way you guys could ride a 22.5 or larger. Like what's the point of making this super long front end frame and adding a short rear end? Just because it has a short rear end doesn't make it easy to pick up. When you guys say a 22" top tube are you talking actual top tube length or effective top tube length? Let me know.
thanks,
jim
I might be wrong in this understanding so I'll need you guys to correct me. I believe that the way top tube lengths are measured vary from BMX to MTB. So if you come from BMX you are using an effective measurement which is measuring center to center directly along the top tube. The problem with this is that it varies depending on the slope of the top tube. And these days with all the low slung top tubes this measurement can seem out of the norm.
Now if you come from MTB then you are probably using an actual top tube length. This is derived by measuring from center line of the head tube and seat tube, but parallel to the ground. MTB frames according to some sites can vary by almost 3 inches in top tube length going from a small to an XL! In BMX, the frame sizes for the vast majority only vary about a half inch to three quarters. Say 20.5 to 21.25 with most of the being under 21.
Hope this helps. Please correct me where needed.
thanks,
jim
that's rad jim!! and fuck yeah on the photos Jon, u rule!!!!!
I always consider tt lengths in terms of actual center to center length...
hope this helps
I was thinking in terms of the actual, centre of seat-tube to centre of head-tube measurement, would of thought most of the people interested in the model-c would be thinking the same way as all bmxes and djmtb/mtbmxes are measured this way - it's only xc/all-round mtb, road bike and hybrids that get talked about in terms of effective tt length - i guess cos u sit down to pedal much more....
All the dj/street mtb companies i know of and pretty much all the mtbmxers and bmxers i know mean the centre to centre length when talking toptubes!!!
can't imagine anyone was talking effective tt in respect of the model-c
definately meant centre 2 centre - can't imagine anyone talking effective about a "freestyle/freeride" bike of any description
22.5 - i'm tall (6'4"), have size 13 feet, a dodgy back and already own a custom solid 20 with a 22" toptube. I little bit of extra tubibg goes along way for us tall dudes yet like u say it's only a quarter or half inch - can't really imagine the extra length effects the agility that much. anyway us 6ft+ers have the extra leverage!
You guys up there realize this is a 24" BMX Bike, not a mountain bike of any sort. Just seems a lot of you keep referring to it as a Sunday MTN bike.
Also talking in terms of centre to centre, actual tt length, coming from a bmx background thats all i know.
Obviously it's a big bmx not a mtn bike - can't see how/where any one has implied otherwise.
this is exactley what i've been waiting for a decent, nimble handling 24 XLbmx, just wish there was a 22.25"(centre2centre!)toptube size.....
Going back to jims post about why people want these long tts, i reckon it's cos most of us guys interested in this bike are either super tall, super old, have bad backs - or a combination of all 3!!!
I think the reason theres so much exitement and such a desire for longer bmx bikes is cos there are so little choices for the larger/older gentleman in bmx, it's pretty much deuce deuce, dk r/t, custom solid or go mtb
to be honest IMO tt length really doesn't affect handling to that gr8 of an extent - especially in the increments ur talking about - whats half an inch between friends!!!
For me longer tts have always just felt comfy and thus allowed me to ride harder for longer, & of course helped me to stop bashing my knees on the stem!
Was also hoping for a 22.25"(actual)tt length...
just been on bikeguide, where theres a poll on toptube length
35% ride 21", 8% ride 21.25", 2% ride 21.5 and 1.5% ride 22".
Bearing in mind this is talking about 20"bmxes, and the average height of an ADULT( & lets be honest alot of the people voting aren't!)
male is 5'10ish; i think this just goes to show the growing trend towards longer toptubes, went u factor in the bigger wheels/proportions it makes sense for the model-c to come in at least a 22"(centre to centre)tt
Ok, I checked out that bike guide survery and with about 77% of riders polled which is only 144, they ride a frame between the sizes of 20.5-21. The next popular size is 21.25, but it is only a third of one of the other popular sizes. Although I think I can foresee a trend towards a little larger size, but I see no evidence of average sized people riding a 22.
As for who is going to ride this, the only group that would need a larger size are tall people. Old people, if they still want to do tricks, wouldn't want an extremely long front end because it would make it difficult to bunnyhop this thing.
And I believe the bad back thing fits in here too. Most riders complain about having a bad back and fix the problem by getting taller bars. Remember all the low bars from a 7 years ago? Now the trend is towards 8 inch bars or taller, but this shouldn't be considered a fashion trend because it just make sense. Bigger bars remedy the bad back problem far more than a longer bike.
Please remember that this is a 24 inch BMX cruiser not a 20 inch BMX. They feel and act very different, but the best part is you can do all the tricks on it. The bike feels higher off the ground, the wheels are way bigger which changes your wheelbase, for some reason you can nosewheelie this just fine, it tailwhips absolutely fine and there is a one inch difference between your bars and your pegs from a 20 to a 24.
Aaron Ross tailwhipped bunnyhopped first try, straight to pedals. It came around so easy that he caught it well above the ground. I'm pretty sure he is 6ft tall too. At the Trick or Treat Jam in Rochester, he barspinned to manual to whip in along the top of the box jump. I know we aren't Aaron Ross, but after asking him about sizing he said it felt totally fine. Oh and he 360ed on flat ground just like his normal bike. No back wheel pivot or anything like that.
Thanks for all your help
jim
Wassup with the rims you are running in these shots? I will be cannibalizing my wee bike and rebuilding the wheels using my current hubs... I would like to get a budget idea, but id Odyssey plans on coming out with some new 24s I will want to wait for those...
Many thanks. I am STOKED.
yeah i would say it's only those taller than 6'3 who'd wanna ride a 22tt on a 20, but on a 24; who knows? most only come in one size 21.5 so i guess thats the size for average height people on a cruiser, 22 for people above 6ft and 22.25 for those over - it makes sense that the dimensions should increase proportionally to wheelsize, but there should definately be a range of sizes catering to everyone from the average to the very tall rather than the short to the slightly tall as those under average height would be better off sticking with 20" wheels...
hope that makes sense!
p.s. thanks for engaging with all of this jim, it's really refreshing to have a company listen to it's customers
sunday rocks!!!
I think there needs to be 3 sizes one for those sub 6ft, one for those around 6ft and one for those over, ie:
21.25
21.75
22.25
also foot size needs to be taken into account for barspins/x-ups...
To be honest as ur marketing this as a bike for freestyle riding i don't see why smaller people would want to ride one of these over a smaller bike, surely cruisers, by their very nature are aimed at people who feel to cramped on/big for a 20, ergo the leaning towards longer than 21.25 toptubes
u say the difference between pegs and bars is about an inch so it would make sense for the tt length (actual) to be also an inch bigger than a 20.
therefore do the same sizes u do for the 20 frames + an inch, ie: 21, 21.5, 21.75 and 22
as someone whose 6'4" tall having ridden a 22"tt frame - i wouldn't wanna go back to a shorter frame, 22 feels perfect for me (would love to try longer though!)
Are these gonna have the wave downtube - i really hope so....
Also it would be really cool/legit to have a mountless cruiser frame-proper streeeeet!
Oh and black magic would go down a treat also
As far as all this toptube length stuff goes, i'd def want sumthin longa than my current 21.5 mutiny burlish if i was rockin 24s, 22 sounds good for a cruiser for any one over 6ft - i'm 6'2 btw and have never heard bout all this "effective tt" nonsense!
would make sense if u did like the model-d but an inch longer - 21.75, 22, 22.25, cos it basically looks like a giant model d...
would be good to do a new wave 24 also for street with shorter sizes - 21.25, 21.5, 22
nice grinds!
just read all the comments on the sizing post u did a while back, some really good comments on that - the majority wanted a 22 option... macneils deuce has been in production 4 ages and i hear there updating it 4 09, so there must be a market for longer toptubes & personally i'd rather ride a sunday than a macneil. tt length seems to be more personal prefence than anything, i know guys who are like 5'6 riding 21.25 bmxes and ripping - i don't think it really affects the ride all that much it just seems most people prefer more room these days...
jon took this?
i like them!
Already posted up when did the first model-c posts, but felt compelled to chip in my 2 cents again...
As an extremely tall rider i feel really undercatered for in the bmx world and i just think it would cool if a company other than Macneil made a frame (or a size of frame with a 22+ toptube)
Judging by the amount of posts echoing this sentiment, theres obviosly a market.
A bigger wheeled bike seems like a pretty obvious/easy way to give us non-vertically challenged something to rip on.
I know theres a fair few of super-tall pros shredding on the sub 22 frames but from personal experience going from a 21.25"tt to the deuce deuce was amazing, the 21.25 felt far far too small and the deuce deuce felt spot on for me.
Like to get a bigger wheeled bike (and the model- c sounds and looks like a revolutionary cruiser bike) but theres no way i'm going under 22...
fit lurch- 21.5
Will the frame/fork clear a 24x2.4" tire?
Any chance of selling me test model-C frame? I just recked my 24" frame and dont wanna buy another frame I dont want.
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